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 Post subject: Payen head gasket?
PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2013 3:07 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jan 01, 2011 5:13 pm
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Location: Wollaston, Northamptonshire
Drives: Cinquecento and Punto
Unfortunately my journey home yesterday was brought to an abrupt end in a cloud of steam in a lay by on the A5. What at first appeared to be a broken plastic joiner connecting the water pipes together near the bulk head has turned out to be a blown head gasket. I can only assume the pressure built up in the cooling system causing the joint to fail.

Attachment:
File comment: What looked like a simply hose join failure..
cinquecento_broken_down.jpg
cinquecento_broken_down.jpg [ 57.3 KiB | Viewed 1136 times ]


Even after the recovery guy arrived and filled the car with water, he wasn't convinced the head gasket had gone and said it was normal for a cold car to look like this.... I said it defiantly had gone and was taken home on the trailer.

Attachment:
File comment: turned out to be a blown head gasket..
cinquecento_broken_down_2.jpg
cinquecento_broken_down_2.jpg [ 61.46 KiB | Viewed 1136 times ]


The engine was only fitted to the car six weeks ago, it was rebuilt by myself which included the head being skimmed and a brand new head gasket fitted. The car had be running perfect up until this point, no water loss. I have since been told that FAI gaskets are rubbish and to avoid them, bit late but at least I know to avoid them!

I have been recommended a Payen head gasket, more specifically a MLS (Multi Layer Steel) gasket as a replacement. The problem I have is I cannot find one. I have found two different thickness fibre gaskets made by Payen, why do they make two of the same gasket in different thickness's? But I cannot for the life of me find a Payen MLS gasket for the Fiat Cinquecento or even any Fiat F.I.R.E engine for that matter.

Does anybody know where I can get one, maybe a part number?

Thanks!

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1994 Cinquecento SX 899cc - Yellow (Green)
1996 Cinquecento Sporting 1108cc - Broom Yellow
1998 Cinquecento Sporting 1108cc - Broom Yellow - Restored & Sold
Follow my adventures - http://blog.kevinmace.co.uk


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 Post subject: Re: Payen head gasket?
PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2013 6:34 pm 
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Location: Teesside
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Might be worth getting in touch with Big Mick at eurocarcare - 01332 345 869 or email parts@eurocarcare.co.uk.

Also worth asking Lee as I'm sure he uses them.

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.....make it idiot proof and someone will build a better idiot.


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 Post subject: Re: Payen head gasket?
PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2013 7:08 pm 
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Location: Wollaston, Northamptonshire
Drives: Cinquecento and Punto
I will give Mick a call tomorrow and see if he can get them. All parts won't deal with Payen and Euro car parts wouldn't look without the car reg even after telling them the make/model/year/engine, hopeless.

Do you know about the different thickness fibre gaskets Payen offer, why the two choices of thickness?

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1994 Cinquecento SX 899cc - Yellow (Green)
1996 Cinquecento Sporting 1108cc - Broom Yellow
1998 Cinquecento Sporting 1108cc - Broom Yellow - Restored & Sold
Follow my adventures - http://blog.kevinmace.co.uk


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 Post subject: Re: Payen head gasket?
PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2013 10:23 pm 
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Drives: Seicento sporting
I tried getting hold of a Payen head gasket when i rebuilt my 1242 but no joy as apparently they have to be ordered in bulk number? I opted for Elring in the end. No problems whatsoever so far after around 1500k and i've been ringing its neck!

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 Post subject: Re: Payen head gasket?
PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2013 10:38 pm 
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Location: Wollaston, Northamptonshire
Drives: Cinquecento and Punto
Glad to hear Elring gaskets are ok, as I may end up buying one if I can't get a Payen.

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1994 Cinquecento SX 899cc - Yellow (Green)
1996 Cinquecento Sporting 1108cc - Broom Yellow
1998 Cinquecento Sporting 1108cc - Broom Yellow - Restored & Sold
Follow my adventures - http://blog.kevinmace.co.uk


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 Post subject: Re: Payen head gasket?
PostPosted: Tue Sep 10, 2013 1:26 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jan 01, 2011 5:13 pm
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Location: Wollaston, Northamptonshire
Drives: Cinquecento and Punto
I just spoke with Lee as he recommend the Payen MLS head gasket, he had the Payen part number to hand which has helped me get one on order 8)

lee wrote:
AE5240 it's been absolutely faultless on rusty and used a few on puntos too. There thinner than standard gasket also, time it up with the marks on flywheel and bell housing when u do it.
Payne one isn't the cheapest but well worth it. Should be around £30 ish


Called up Jayar car parts who are local to me, gave them the part number Payen AE5240 and have one on order, not too expensive either at £19.75 + VAT. Lets hope it's the right one when I go to collect it on Friday.

For those interested I have attached an image showing the list of cars which use this gasket.

Attachment:
payen-head-gasket.JPG
payen-head-gasket.JPG [ 122.07 KiB | Viewed 1122 times ]


Big thanks to Lee for the part number and information! 8)

_________________
1994 Cinquecento SX 899cc - Yellow (Green)
1996 Cinquecento Sporting 1108cc - Broom Yellow
1998 Cinquecento Sporting 1108cc - Broom Yellow - Restored & Sold
Follow my adventures - http://blog.kevinmace.co.uk


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 Post subject: Re: Payen head gasket?
PostPosted: Tue Sep 10, 2013 2:11 pm 
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Joined: Mon Apr 02, 2007 8:10 pm
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Location: Northwich, Cheshire
Drives: Cinquecento Abarth 1242
For reference


Attachments:
File comment: 1108 on top of 1242
IMG_1549[1].jpg
IMG_1549[1].jpg [ 2.12 MiB | Viewed 1120 times ]
File comment: 1242 top 1108 bottom
IMG_1550[2].jpg
IMG_1550[2].jpg [ 2.09 MiB | Viewed 1120 times ]

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Rusty the soon to be 1242 TURBO Cinquecento Abarth
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 Post subject: Re: Payen head gasket?
PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2013 4:27 pm 
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Location: Wollaston, Northamptonshire
Drives: Cinquecento and Punto
Picked the gasket up today and looks spot on. Cost £23.70 with VAT.

It's different to the ones in Lee's post above as they appear to be fibre with the red ring around the edge, this one is just plain black and made of multiple steel layers (hence the name).

Edit: added photo.
Attachment:
File comment: Payen AE5240
IMAG0111.jpg
IMAG0111.jpg [ 1.05 MiB | Viewed 1109 times ]


Will sort the car out this weekend and post the state of the existing FAI head gasket.

_________________
1994 Cinquecento SX 899cc - Yellow (Green)
1996 Cinquecento Sporting 1108cc - Broom Yellow
1998 Cinquecento Sporting 1108cc - Broom Yellow - Restored & Sold
Follow my adventures - http://blog.kevinmace.co.uk


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 Post subject: Re: Payen head gasket?
PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2013 5:18 pm 
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Joined: Mon Apr 02, 2007 8:10 pm
Posts: 1814
Location: Northwich, Cheshire
Drives: Cinquecento Abarth 1242
Forgot to add, ive always used a product called wellseal when ive used one of these gaskets.
Its like a non setting gasket compound, its very good especially if the heads slightly pitted or the block.
Apply liberally to both head and block leave for 5 mins then assemble. It goes everywere and squeezes the excess out upon tightening the head bolts.

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Rusty the soon to be 1242 TURBO Cinquecento Abarth


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 Post subject: Re: Payen head gasket?
PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2013 6:43 am 
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Joined: Thu Mar 22, 2007 9:20 pm
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Location: Teesside
Drives: Panda 100hp
Lee, can you get hold of part numbers for a mk1 Punto Sporting 16v gasket please?

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Pete, technical bod.

.....make it idiot proof and someone will build a better idiot.


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 Post subject: Re: Payen head gasket?
PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2013 8:46 am 
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Joined: Mon Apr 02, 2007 8:10 pm
Posts: 1814
Location: Northwich, Cheshire
Drives: Cinquecento Abarth 1242
Pete
AD5830 Headgasket
JM5176 Cam Carrier gasket

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Rusty the soon to be 1242 TURBO Cinquecento Abarth


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 Post subject: Re: Payen head gasket?
PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2013 1:24 pm 
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Location: Wollaston, Northamptonshire
Drives: Cinquecento and Punto
Cheers Lee, I will get some wellseal as well 8)

_________________
1994 Cinquecento SX 899cc - Yellow (Green)
1996 Cinquecento Sporting 1108cc - Broom Yellow
1998 Cinquecento Sporting 1108cc - Broom Yellow - Restored & Sold
Follow my adventures - http://blog.kevinmace.co.uk


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 Post subject: Re: Payen head gasket?
PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2013 4:28 pm 
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Joined: Thu Mar 22, 2007 9:20 pm
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Location: Teesside
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Cheers Lee :D

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.....make it idiot proof and someone will build a better idiot.


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